SPECIAL EPISODE! Interview with Rav Yisroel Levovitz Discussing the Life and Legacy of His Great-Grandfather Rav Yeruchom Levovitz on his Yahrtzeit (Rebroadcast)

0:00 It is my understanding that tonight and tomorrow is the 87th Yort site of your Heilig. Zayda. Great-grandfather, great-grandfather Moran Rav Yerucham L'Vovitz, zohran L'Vracha. Correct. Site. Kaisivan 1936, havreish Tarek Vov Aha. And therefore I thought that it would be exciting to have you on the podcast to ask you some questions to further understand this great Godel. He's someone that I am enamored by. I will try my best to answer, but don't think for a second that I understand him, because I don't. But I can tell you what I know just from growing up with him.

0:42 The backdrop of my life. You know, nobody understands him. Him, he was too great for us to understand, you know I hear. So let's get right into it. Would you perhaps like to give the audience a just a introduction as to who you are and your relationship to this great individual? okay, so, like I said, my father, his name is Rabbi Rucham Lubavitz. He was the first in the family named after his grandfather, my father's father. My grandfather was Rabbi Moshe Leib Lubavitz is Rabbi Rucham's son, and then Rabbi Rucham was my great-grandfather. And you said your father's name is Rabbi Rucham as well right.

1:23 Correct my father was born in 1941. Yerucham was left there in 1936. Yes, uh-huh, uh-huh, it is. I must just to kick off the conversation. Is it someone that you? I have sort of a feeling that it's kind of found new love and new respect about this figure. It's kind of found new love and new respect about this figure. I mean, there has only been a biography that's come out about him now, almost 87 years after he's passed away, and it makes no sense to me and it feels like some sort of wave is coming with his Musser and his approach. Do you feel the same way with that? I am quite interested to hear. Well, no, again his biography.

2:04 If you take a look at the biography that came out recently in English, before that in Hebrew, it's not much of a biography per se. It's more about his derech and his musr and the things that he put into people. It's more about his derech than about him as a person. Him as a person was not. There were many things about him that a person, him as a person was not. It was not. You know, there were many things about him that are obscure, that we don't know about his. You know his early life, or there were pockets within his later life that we don't really know much, when he was running. What does that mean? What does that mean? That means that we don't know much about his parents. We don't really know much about him. When he got married, we know that he went to Raden and he spent eight years in the Chagat Z'Chayim's Kachem Koyol.

2:49 Once he was married, then he sort of came on the scene being the Mashkiach in Raden At some point. He was the Mashkiach in Panovich At some point. They say he might have been something. He was Mash. It was. Mashiach, in Panovich, in the town of Panovich, not in Sheba Panovich. Again, there were times during World War I, especially when he was running, running, when there were packets of years where we really don't know what was going on with him. No, you could pick up bits and pieces from different books, different sightings for lack of a better word of him. But until the golden years of the Mir. That's when he first really took over the scene and from there is what we know of him, as early as we know that when he first got married he learned in the Kachem Kael.

3:34 He learned with Khabrusa, with the Naftali Trap. They finished together. He learned with Khabrusa and Kalim. We do know these, these things about him, but until? But the rabbi rucham that you know is the rucham of the mirror aha, that is very interesting, right. It feels like the way that the authors put it, the historians is that the mirror of his golden age was during the 20s and kind of took all that he had from the Chavetz Chaim and all that he had from Slabotga and all that he had from Kelm and then brought it to a time that was just perfectly ripe to be able to share it with the world he was definitely a product of.

4:22 You know the Altav and Kelm as well, the Altav and Slab who was Rebbein, but more you know the Altaf al-Kalim was really his Rebbe. You know, everything he said was and he said about himself was a pirish on what he heard from the Altaf al-Kalim. All his shmoozan, all his va'ad, it was all like being mefarish. Everything he learned from the Alta of the Kelim and, mind you, he only learned from the Alta of the Kelim for a year or less. After that he stayed in Kelim by the Alta of Nahum Zev, the Alta of the Son and the Alta of the Son-in-law. But the Alta was just a year of his life but it was such a profound impact it had on him that the rest of his life he was, you know, living with that and teaching that.

5:02 He was in Raden before or after Kelm. So I believe he was in Raden afterwards Kelm was his formative years. Then he went to Raden after he got married. He stayed there in Keul for eight years and then he sort of became a Dimashkiach there. Then there was you know again. It's not so clear what happened between him and the Chavetz Chaim, but it wasn't the right place for him. He was maybe too dynamic for that crowd or whatever. Right, because that was going to ask you for some clarification on that, because the way that it's written over in the books, especially, I think, the way his son writes it in Das Torah, is that he felt already that it was one or two Bacha that were coming over to him and instead of going over to the Chavetz Chaim and he felt like it was just taking away and he was so unfitting in the presence.

5:55 There's a lot of truth to that. Yeah, I mean, he was definitely felt that that wasn't the place where he could, or maybe should, be the go-to person. The Chavetz Chaim was there and the derech of the Chavetz Chaim and his derech were not always the same derech. It wasn't anything contentious or anything, because he felt that that's just not where I belonged. Interesting. So the other side of the story is that perhaps it wasn't the same hal between Rabbi Rucham and the Chavetz Chaim. Something like that. Yeah, Again, I can't tell you with clarity. I've heard various different versions of the story from different people, from different tzvarim. It just wasn't where he belonged. He just felt that he can be more productive elsewhere and less of an issue with the derach of what was going on in Raden.

6:42 Aha, aha. That's my understanding, i's my mistake, I got it. I got it, and from from raden, he then went immediately to his next stellar, his next position it's not immediately, because you know he he did. You know, at one point they wanted him to come to calum and then world war one got in the way. It wasn't a smooth sailing type of thing at all. You know there was an issue going on in the Mir at the time which is why they brought him in. Actually it wasn't like he just like a Womashki, had passed away and needed another one, the Mir that we know of. You know the Altimir. You know you're a Blade Mahler and there's a whole program about that Mir. You know, before he came in it was a very old yeshiva. I think it was the second oldest yeshiva after Golazhin.

7:23 But at that time there was a lot of let's say, I don't know if you want to call it mismanagement, or you know it wasn't, things weren't going smoothly and Nebuleh Zidl I think it was a yeshiva at the time saw that he needed to bring someone in. So you know, I believe that Alta Ben Slobatov was the one who told Ibrahim Lezidl to bring Ibrahim in. And it was really a tremendous thing on Ibrahim Lezidl's part, because I think he knew, going in, that he was pretty much giving the yeshiva away to Ibrahim. Ibrahim's personality was such that when he came over to the yeshiva I mean Ibrahim Lezidl was the Rosh Yeshiva but Ibrahim became the you know, the guy you know.

8:04 He was so captivating the way they put it. They all became and Ablazidl knew that and he didn't care, because that was his personality in general, ablazidl, ablazidl, anything for the furtherment of Torah, you know, whether it's his own yeshiva or a different yeshiva. He wasn's a selfless kind of person. He knew going in that he's giving the yeshiva to rebbe rohan, but that's what he wanted, that's what he did. That's why it produced what it did amazing. So I must ask you about he. He's obviously famous for his talks, his lectures, these, the way, his one-on-one meetings with people I always think about.

8:45 Though, how did he spend his day Meaning as a mashkiach? Does it mean that he would wake up with the bachram and he'd have a chachas at the yeshiva? Let's jump to 1920s, when they're roaring the golden age of mir, and he's there. There's 200 bachram in the mir, and is he there at the mir? He's dabbling with them. He's sitting in first state with them. He's answering their Gammara questions. Or does he have his own office and they come to him for advice? So again, first of all, for a large part of the time that he was in the mirror, his family wasn't there. They were in a different city in those events and he was in the mirror and he only went home once a year or maybe twice a year. But interestingly, just as an aside, parenthetically all his children have the same birthday, which is an interesting thing about it.

9:31 He went home once a year, and all his children. It's just interesting. But yeah, he pretty much lived in the yeshiva even after they moved to the mirror. He didn't sit, I don't think, in the Besmedushah all day. He had what's called a shalka. It was a room upstairs which had a window down to the Besmedushah. He spent a lot of time up there, whether it was learning, whether it was meeting with Bachram, but I don't know if he sat in Besmedushah all day or sat upstairs. I was in that room actually many years ago when I went to visit it. I actually is this in the modern mir building in the mirror. I wouldn't call modern, but today a post office in a town of mir in belarus. The yeshiva building still stands. It's a post office and upstairs is what is like a I don't know, I guess an attic or a room.

10:14 Wait, that was his room and I used to spend most of his time. There were people. I know a lot of stories that I've heard over the years. Bochum would go and speak to him. They would go upstairs to speak to him. So I'm sure he made it to the Besmetish as well. But he did spend a lot of time up there, whether it was observing the Bahram, learning, you know, preparing Shmuzim, whatever. He wasn't the Rosh Yeshiva. He wasn't answering the Marah questions per se. I mean not that he didn't know the Marah, he's, of course he did, you see from the Bucky in the large Chalak of Kala Terekula, but that wasn't his role with the Bachra. It's in trying to acquire a Mahalik, like the way he would think, what he was famous for. It's clear that the derech it feels like to me, the derech of Rabbi Ruchem, is that he would immediately take everything for face value.

11:03 If Chazal say it, then that's what Chazal meant. They're not changing anything, and every time he would try to prove or develop a topic it's remarkable how he's citing Mara Mechomos throughout Shas. Listen, you know, the Briscoe Rav famously said that what Reb Chaim Briscoe was to the Rambam, Reb Recham was to Mamari Chazal. In other words, he didn't just greet. Chazal and say a schmooze Chazal, like you said, was real to him. He took it apart, like the way Reb Chaim would take a plot of Rambam and say we've got to dissect it and figure out what the Rambam's saying. That's what he did to Mamari Chazal.

11:46 I mean he knew Chumash and Rashi cold. I know my interesting tidbit my grandfather, my shaleh, when he was at Kufa, when I think between during the World War I, whenever it was, and they were running that, my grandfather and my great-grandfather he would learn Chumash and Rashi with him every single day for like a couple years straight and he Rashi with him every single day for like a couple years straight and he would tell him that a year has to know how much Rashi cold, because all the soldiers of Amuna are in Hamas Rashi. Everything now everything else is is, you know, you know it's all good murder, but Hamas Rashi is every side of Amuna that I yet has to know and anything and everything the lies in Hamas Rashi it's unbelievable. That's what he did. I mean he dissected that. So come hereumash and Rashi. It's unbelievable. That's what he did. He dissected that Sukkum, he dissected the Rashi, he dissected the Medrash, he dissected the Rambans.

12:30 That's what he did. Like you said, if Chazal said it, it was true. Now we're going to figure out how it's true, what they meant and what we can learn from it. Right, right, and part of the cool. The cool, you know, reason why I am so blown away by him is because it feels like I'd love to get your thoughts about this. It feels like he is the, he comes from that world that we almost wish we could tap into, of Kelm and Slobodka and Europe and all of it. But he's kind of the link where actually in the book All for the Boss, from Recham Hashem talking about her father, there's that famous chapter there of where it's she and her husband are speaking about their times in living in Mir and how they see Rabbi Recham L'Vovitz, rabbi Recham L'Vovitz, and how it feels like it's this big collision between American Bachrim, you know, the United States of America into Mir and it's this big connection between Europe, slavodka, kelm, and then am I right in assuming that he is someone who brought yeah, so you're actually tapping into something interesting, which is the Mir had two types of Bahrim.

13:39 There was what's called the Icelander, which means people who came from outside of the. You know the inner Europe. That would include Americans, that would include even Germans. You know people who came from Canada and things like that. That's who Das Teure is Now the difference between Das Koffer Musser with the three-volume blue set. Oh, so let's give an introduction, just give an introduction for the audience that doesn't know. So now the and correct me if I'm wrong, but there's, his rabbi rucham's works are published in kind of nine books, I guess. Maybe actually let me let you hand it over to you to describe, yeah, in other words, rucham himself worked to publish this form of the altopunkele.

14:20 That was his life's work, his, his own work. He didn't publish his son. My great uncle was the one who worked his entire life to publish ibrahim's works. Okay now, the difference between das kakhamusir is a three-volume set of uh, you know, of shmuzin. Those are basically the shmuzin that he gave at the yeshiva. He gave a shmuz four times a week and that the das kakhamusir shmuzin that were. Those are much more higher level stuff. Taz Torah was based on a Chumash Vahd that he gave specifically to the Icelanders, means to the people who came from America, the people who came from Germany and such, the ones that he felt did not have the bedrock, the foundation, the proper foundation that the other Baphomet had.

15:04 They were on a lower level, for lack of a better term, and he felt that he had to boost their Amunah. He had to boost their connection to Chazal, to the Taira, to the you know to be B'nai Taira, to be able to be on the level of a European B'nai Taira like Reb Leib Malin or Reb Leib Malin or Reb Yannick Karpalov or the Lions of the Mirror. The Americans had to be able to contend with that, so he gave them a lot of attention and that was that special Fumishbat and that's what's known today as Das Terra. It's all based on that. It's different. The Shmuzim were geared to one crowd and much more, maybe higher level or deeper level or much more Kalam-y or more Slav-Bak-y.

15:49 And the Das Teru was much. We brought it down a level in a way, but not brought it down to content. That's why it's so much easier for us to relate to Das Teru stuff not that it's easy, but easier than the Das Chacham Moshe stuff. Das Chacham Moshe stuff is very much calm. Who was Das Chacham Moshe taught to. That was the Shmuzin. That was the Shmuzin that he gave the whole yeshiva, yeah, the whole yeshiva. Four times a week he gave a Shmuzin to the whole yeshiva and that originally was printed you know little pamphlets. Eventually it got compiled into what we know as Das Dastal Mumsur. You know various Talmidim wrote over Shmuz and then eventually it got.

16:31 It wasn't your great-uncle, it wasn't your great-uncle who did Das Dastal Mumsur. Yes, he was the one who pulled it all together, but he didn't necessarily write all of it. You know what I mean. It was other Talmidim and stuff, das T and stuff, das Teirah was very much him. You know that was his life's work. I remember growing up, you know, when I was a kid only Bereshit existed and a year or two later Shemoyis was published. And as I grew up, you know, until eventually, I remember when Tevarim came out it was like a tremendous simcha. Two volumes of Tevarim, yeah. And then that was like wow, that was a life's work, that my great uncle publishing his father's stuff for the world. That is not a best-selling edition of Clydesdore, that doesn't have Dostoevsky. There's so many. I just imagine this chosem that he has, because there's so many ideas that it feels like these certain foundations of Jewish philosophy, theology and faith are only brought to America.

17:24 It really feels like through his work through Das Taira. Well, that's correct in a way, because again, you have to remember that the Mir Yashiva was pretty much the only European Yashiva that survived as a whole. So there were many great Yashivas in Europe and many, you know, balei, muster, and stuff like that that didn't necessarily make it out as a whole. So his, his talmidim, survived, you know. So there was a, there's a, there's someone there to to, you know, to write it to, to push it out, to populate it to, to propagate it. You know what I mean there was. That's probably the reason why I'm not saying, you know, there were plenty of other people. You know, there was a lepyan, it was a desolate.

18:06 Each one had their own, you know, derek, and they were definitely, you know, great people. But he had a certain dynamic which, coupled with the fact that his talmidim survived and and and and, uh, I looked up to him the way they did. He was it to them. You know, and that's why you know I think that's my personal opinion why it managed to have a resurgence, you know. Why do you think that he is so? People were so obsessed with him. Right, there are people that I know make suit, those, including myself, in times that they were introduced to Rabbi Rucham.

18:48 Why is he so compelling, would you say? What makes him so? I'm obsessed with the speeches, First of all. Also, I want to make the point that the way that this farmer also written Das Teirah, he's clearly a fantastic author. He's clearly a fantastic author. Well, a lot of that is credit to my great uncle, who was a fantastic writer. That's what I meant to say. I meant to compliment. Right. So yes, rabbi Ruchem was a fantastic person and a fantastic he knew how to give a schmooze and he connected. But a lot of it has to do, at least on print, is the way of some physical was able to take it and capture it onto the page and you can read it, and you can sort of hear the schmooze as you're reading it literally many times myself different rabbanim that I've heard them speak and I read this form and it's not the same.

19:41 It's not automatic that when you say a speech and you transcribe it to print that it retains its vivacity. You know what I mean. It's remarkable, I can, I picture it. He writes like tomorrow, like you see him screaming with exclamation marks and it's beautiful, beautiful. Why this is for asking for the audience really To make it more accessible. Do you believe that there maybe would be a time that Das Tire would be published in English? Or perhaps get ArtScroll on board and just make a campaign. Honestly, I don't think that will happen. Why? I just don't A I don't think the family or the ones who would do it are into that.

20:25 I feel they feel that its authenticity would be diminished, you know, if it became translated. It's just a personal feeling, just knowing the family and knowing, you know, the people behind it Again, will it eventually happen? Who knows? I know there are, you know, I do see. You know Rabbi I forgot his name Rabbi Alderstein or something does put out a weekly. That's terror in english. It's been done as a here and there pamphlets, things like that. I just don't see it. Uh, you know anyone? Uh, getting on board, you know from the family at least having a translation english again that down the line, who knows? It's 87 years now that it hasn't happened yet you? know and where's his family now?

21:06 Like when you're referring to that family, who's in charge? Who are they and where are they? um, they're all over. I mean most of them in america, you know you know, whether lakewood and brooklyn. Muncie there's uh someone out to stroll, but we're loving the place, you know. But the, you know it's. Again, like I said, I don't know if there's one person in charge. It was his little son and Muncie is very involved with it. There's others involved with it, but again, it's not something I can see happening. I wouldn't be shocked if it happened. I'd be surprised. Mm, mm. All right, I guess I'm going to have to try to get in touch with the family. I feel like there's just obviously the authenticity needs to be probably protected and it's definitely something special, and sometimes it's even when you read the Vart in Hebrew.

21:53 Sometimes it's almost painful to hear the truth coming, that it hurts to read. See, part of the reason is what you just said. You called it a Vart, one of the things a family, like a lot of people in the family, have an issue with. I know from the older generation. I'm from the younger generation. I don't have a problem with anybody. I love everybody. But, a lot of the older people are trying to protect whatever it is they're protecting. You know I won't call it a vart. It's not a vart. It's so much deeper than that. It's the total understanding of Arashi. It's the total. This is what the Pasuk means. This is not a that you say, it's not from that you write on a Pasha sheet. You know this is part of why they're very protective of the, of the authenticity of it.

22:38 You know. He doesn't say you know, he tells you how to read Arashi. He tells you how to learn a lesson from Arashi. He teaches you, you know the basics of Amunah. You know everything's Amunah. Everything boils down to Amunah. That was his key. Why do you say that? Because that's just the overall message on. Everything he said was obviously Torah-based. But Amunah V'yid has to have Amunah Yidd has to learn Amunah from the Torah. You read Rishis, and if you read Vayikra, if you read the Varam, you have to be able to walk away with Amunah of Hashem. That's the key message that he was always pushing. Now, amunah doesn't just mean you know this psychedelic thing Amunah is throughra and through everything else and through Musser, but ultimately it's about Amun and Hashem.

23:29 Wow, I never would have said that, I never would have thought that. Now that I said it, next time you read a piece, try to keep that in mind, you'll see this. You walk away from anything that he says At least that's personal, that's my personal opinion. You walk away from anything you learn from him. You walk away with a stronger Emunah and Hashem, and that's the key, you know. Right, Right, Right. And it's coming to mind a couple different, even examples of where it definitely feels like there's Emunah in in. Uh, I mean, how many times do you talk about Nesionis and Emunah Like, and how many times do you talk about Emunah's Chazal, Emunah's Chachamim? There you go.

24:09 Emunah's Chazal is just an iteration of Emunah and Hashem. You know, it's all Emunah and Hashem. The stronger a person's Emunah is, the stronger he'll be able to fight in siena it's the stronger person's amuna the more, the better his title will be. It's all. It's based on the moon, amuna is the olive. That's what I love, for a reason, you know the key to everything. Wow, amuna is the key to everything. Let's put that as the podcast title absolutely wow. So also, I was thinking, as you were talking about what Reb Yerucham really stands for and you're saying that it's Emunah. I have like, even on my notes before I came on to have this discussion, thinking about what Reb Yerucham means to me and to try to compare and contrast what someone who's from the same tree, from the same family, what your zayden means to you.

25:04 I was thinking that there's, he very much means to me. He's he's, he's shulling, he's. You know he talks a lot about completeness, which I was gonna ask for a perspective. He talks at great length, famously, about your, your etsem, your eye right, what defines you and defining your myelis, and that has come through in Revolbus, tahira, right, absolutely. So I'd be interested for a take on that. And also, how do you feel like maybe that's also in emunah or you feel like that's something different? There's emunah in Hashem, there's emunah in Chachamim, there's emunah in yourself. It's all keys to.

25:51 That's what it's all about, right? You can't. You know, torah is a Shira. You can't get to the Shira until you have Amunah in Hashem. The stronger your Amunah in Hashem, the stronger your Amunah in Hashem, the stronger your Amunah in the Torah. And what the Torah teaches the stronger Yarmulid in Yiddishkeit, the stronger Yarmulid in yourself, the stronger Jew you can be, the more Muslim you can be like you said. Yes, shlemus is a tremendous, you know goal, in Kellum especially. But you know that was one of his things. I mean, he didn't just do things, he didn't do anything without thinking about it. Everything he did was on his ladder to perfection. He didn't blink without thinking. Should I blink today? No, he didn't make moves, he didn't run.

26:34 Every move he made in his life was calculated. That was the Kelm way. Kelm would do things just, you can throw down a book on the floor, it makes a sound. Everyone jumps In. Kalim, they would have moved. Their life's work was total mastery over their every move. That's the kalim way. He was like the epitome of that. He was like the Altav. And Kalim famously said that if my whole derruch was done to produce him. It would have been worth it. Even the Altar of Mikael looked at him as my perfect prototype of what I was trying to do.

27:18 And there's also definitely a strong undertone of Godless Ha'adim in his works as well. From Slavotka right. That's a Slavotka influence, of course, but that wasn't where he focused so much. You know, the author of Slavotka himself didn't necessarily have the same way of doing things, you know. Also yeah. The author of Slavotka. His way was to. You know, every person should grow and become, become whatever he's supposed to be. Ibrahim's way was more to mold everyone into be that. You know there was even a. You know I'm not going to say a machalikas, but the altar once quipped that.

27:59 You know that Ibrahim is making soldiers Right Like you, just make everyone to be, you know, whatever, whereas I'm trying to mold them into something else. You know, each one on their own individuality. Again, it's a different derrach. No, that G-dless Adam just by definition has to let everyone reach their own potential, because you can't be G-dless Adam, you know, ask if you're have to be something. That's not you. And whereas his mahalaf was more like no, we know what adim hashalom looks like and we all got to get there. Really. You know. So it was more of a. Again, I'm not going to say it was a mahalik, it was chas v'shalom, but it was no. I always understood, and even at the end of that story, I always understood that Rabbi Rucham took the mussar and and there was a change, there was a shift like he actually changed the way that.

28:45 I've heard it over and I know I could cite a source, even I know that, uh, rabbi huda geber, on his podcast from one of the episodes with rabbi roham, cites that story and I believe, also brings there that there you, can you he. There was some sort of change in the philosophy and that the new way of education was going to be to build soldiers. But then it's clear from the writings, especially in devarim, that. But we need to make sure everyone's doing it on his own, derrick. I mean, how many times do you say that's? so this is my own personal feeling, again, when I'm everything I'm saying is is my own personal uh, you know feeling of it. There was a story that I heard, actually from you know, a reliable source, that in 1929, when it was the massacre in chevron right which the chevron was obviously slabatka right and the story goes that there was a bachar who was lying dying on the floor bleeding, and the bachar who was bleeding turned to the bachar who was next to him and said here, take blood from me and put it on yourself so they'll think you're dead, so they won't kill you.

29:45 Okay, and he saved the other bracha's life. That's what he did. He took right and they say and I heard this from a reliable source that Rabbi Ruchem was told of this story. He said, if that's what the altar's deruch could produce, maybe he has the right deruch. Again, that was godless enough to say, you know, maybe he has a point. If that's the ultimate of a person on the way out who's dying, could stop and think about, you know, the guy next to him, as opposed to worrying about his own life. Again, this is what I heard from reliable source. Um, but again, so maybe, maybe that that was like a little bit of a jolt to him that maybe there's something in it. You know, again, this is my own personal feelings.

30:26 It's not documented or anything, it's just uh the personal feelings of the family, and and this is a behind the scenes approach seems to me also that it's very, very often is kind of more even true than what gets to the general public could be, could be listen. Like I said, you know, it's not that my opinion matters more than anyone else's, but this is just. You know. When you grow up, you know many decades and this is all you hear. And you hear everything is. You know, you hear things and you pick up things. You know taking from what you think your Zayda is, and if he was around Beznan HaZeh and he would see, you know, you know, well, let's maybe.

31:12 I want to give an introduction to the question, a short one, just that. We definitely have already discovered that Rabbi Rucham is kind of. His mahalik was to always, you know, take from even larger things. I know he left Kelm because there was some dispute about how to run it after the altar had died back and forth with. I believe it was one of the Rav Desslers, maybe Rav Dessler's father or something Ruvain Dov Dessler. It wasn't, he left. They originally wanted to bring him in and he actually turned it down because of certain conditions that they didn't want to bring him in and he actually turned it down because of certain conditions that they didn't want to let him do. He was never there. They wanted to bring him in as a Mishkiach and Kell After Rav Nachum Belville passed away, I believe.

31:54 What about the? famous story. They're yelling back and forth in the base of Medrash. No, I don't think that's accurate. I think he sent certain that he would come if X, y and Z happened, or whatever it is, and the Kalim family at the time wasn't ready to accept that or whatever it was. Again, it was basically a difference in derach as well. One of the things, for example, was Kalim. Everyone knows the big Kalim yeshiva the largest it ever was at any point was 24 buffer, right, I think one of the things was that he wanted to make he wanted to make a larger or something, you know, things like that that he felt that 24 buck was.

32:37 You know it could be bigger, I couldn't influence more, you know so this this was I was going to try to get to is is that he was always, it seems like, from my understanding, in trying to take this philosophy, broaden it, connect it to more people and even, it seems like, perhaps, water it down, because as the generations get further away from Atantayor, there is a little bit of a weaker stamina in people, it sounds like. And that's why you gave those to the out-of-towners, them to the out-of-towners. It seems like Lishit also his mahalik, was very much reformatting the shiitos and opinions of these great ones for the new generation. So to the question. Here's what I want to get to. I guess it's. So let's assume Lut Yitzur, let's say, okay, I was Bismarck has that, where there is definitely a lot of issues for that, or new issues in Klyos, because we're so living amongst other cultures, gentiles and the like, we are more distracted, you know, more than ever, more distracted more than ever and it always feels to me like we're out of sorts much more than ever.

33:50 And Rabbi Rucham definitely was a big promoter of Seder and organization in a person's life. If he was asked to give Rabbi Rucham the microphone at the Daf Yoi Mi Siyam Hashash in Madison Square Garden and they say give a half-hour Mussar Shmuz to the congregation of Jewish people and what should they work on and what do they need to know to get to their goal, what do you think he would say? Well, that's a loaded question there, but I don't think he would say anything much different than what he's always said always, you know, always, you know, you know. Again, we live in a generation where I believe, the overall Nisayan that we have is a Nisayan of Amun, and I can even say that, you know, the generation of Moshiach is going to struggle with Amun.

34:41 Now we can say technology, et cetera, et, etc. But it all boils down to Amunah. Because when you believe in God, we believe the Torah is true and Chazal is true and the Torah doesn't change, then you don't change. It's when the times change, and every time you look around there's people trying to change, whether it's just how do you identify or who could you marry. The whole world is just change, change, change. And the Torah says don't change, don't change don't change. That's what he believed. We don't change, we adapt. Maybe we don't change, you know again. So maybe he would adapt to the current world or help us, but not with change.

35:21 And there's a big difference, you know we not with change. And there's a big difference. You know we don't change. You know the Amun about Hashem has to be. You know what does that mean? It doesn't mean Amun doesn't mean faith. It means steady, steady Mosh's hands were steady. It means that no matter what life throws at us, we're steady. You know. It says, you know there's a word they say you have to be kaveh itim l'tayri, you said var, you said var, but it's not from him. Oh, okay, good the vart the vilt says you have to be kaveh the chazal says they're going to ask you if you're going to be kaveh, item lataira, right?

36:02 So what is the word item? That's a funny thing. You're going to be kaveh z'man, lataira, right? Or eis lataira, what's item? Kaveh item lataira. Okay. So some say you know it's item plural once a day, by night, but they should have said kavata z'man lataira. Now it's referring to you know, in Kahalas you have, a person's life is full of different situations, different lives, different that we have there's always. And the question was no matter what's going on in your life, were you steady? That's the whole part of means.

36:42 No matter what's going on in your life, right, a bad day, a good day, a bad day, a good day, a bad hair day, a good hair day. You have a wedding, you have a Leviah, but boys, don't forget to learn that's the steadiness of Torah that demands for us, of Shemayim, and that, I believe, is an offshoot of this Amunah that I'm talking about, that he spoke about. I think that Amunah means steady, steady, steady, steady. Whoever you are, you've got to keep being that person throughout, whatever's going on in your life. You've got to be that person every month. You've got to be that person in every situation, whether life's good or life's not so good, right, whether you have a job or you don't have a job, whatever's going on in your life, you means you're holding on to Hashem, holding on to the Torah, you're holding on to Chazal.

37:23 And again, that doesn't change, that's true in 1936, and it's true, in 2036. Wow, wow. So you believe that he would preach to the masses not to change in the face of uncertainty and the winds of change? I think so. Yeah, again in Yeshiva, speak, that would be. Hold on to the Maserah, hold on to the Emmas, hold on to the Torah, hold on to what the Arabian taught us. You know it doesn't change. You know it looks differently, it's packaged differently, but it can't change. This is the problem today. People are to happen and you know that's, that's not the way you know, right, we gotta, we gotta hold on to the to the truth.

38:09 Truth doesn't change. Truth can't change right right. Truth cannot change by definition that's right and that's what he was. He was a man of truth. He's a man that sought the truth. He's a man that that that lived his life by the truth. He's a man that taught the truth. He's a man who, who you know nothing that wasn't true, you know worked with him. No, he, he. He was a mvakesh, a emes that's emes ve'emuna goes together, emes ve'emuna. All back to emula wow, wow, wow. It definitely brings to mind. I mean, I just learned a piece from abirucham that he's talking about, where Rashi said that even if a person has finished all of Torah, still he shouldn't leave to go study other.

38:54 You can never finish. You can never finish. So Abirucham says why it doesn't seem right. If you are finished, then let's be real, then you're finished, a truth-seeking individual like he was. It's over and he goes into it. He says because there's something called absorption and there's something called making something one with you and habituation. And the more you do something and you don't change, it becomes into your soul and it gets into your zik and it just becomes part of you and he actually learns. It's like a mitzvah to be in fire. I think he pretty much learns this pasuk when I think it's the Navi Ishaaya maybe. He says that the Yiddin are just you know, they're doing their mitzvahs at Nashi Milumada. That's right.

39:50 All these people like the first couple words in the puzzle, all these people are just davening and they're learning. But they're, but they're just doing it by you know, habitually. He says and then I'll be changed. It's not working because they need to be doing it and not showing the mother. It's a good thing. I'm not sure, pretty sure, that he learns as I. Okay, very I mean I maybe I'm off, but I believe that could work nicely and. I don't recall that piece and again, I'm not a fucky in this, by any means. I mean, I know a little bit here and there but, it makes sense it definitely makes sense that you know, we gotta you know again. Nobody says, you should do things by rote you know, if you just do like the apostle says, you know, like Hashem says, but yes, we do do things because my father said so, because my Zayda said so.

40:32 You know my father. A lot of times I ask him why we do something. That's what my father did, why he do it Because that's what his father did. That's you know. That's what Avraham Avinu did. Yeah, we have a Masari. We, that's, you know, but Avram Avinu did. Yeah, we have a Masari. We have a Masari and our Masari goes back to the Ruchim, to the Altam Kelem, to the Klamel Hashem, to the Goyim. I mean, this is our Masari. You know most of us. We go back, our Masari goes to the Goyim. But anyone in Klai Shal, their Masari goes, come. No, if you want to go anywhere in life, you got to come from somewhere right now. Wow, well, that's. Uh, let's put that on a t-shirt, right? Um, finishing up here, just have a couple of other really personal questions.

41:13 Hopefully the audience will enjoy them as well. But further in the safer dust, tire out. There is um ma'amorim and the biurim. Uh, what's the difference between those two? Again, so the, the biurim were really that the difference between those two Again. So the Biyurim were really that was a shir that I was telling you about that he gave to the short pieces you know he learned Chumash Rashi, Chumash Rashi, Bazi Bazi. The Marim were more of a schmoozing that he gave and those he probably gave to them also, but more of a schmooze, you know, uh setting rather than a vod setting. So the bureau more like, um, a vod setting and my mom more of a schmooze setting. You know, I don't know this for a fact I'm assuming that he gave them schmoozing.

42:06 I'm pretty much rounds out the the. You know the main points I want to get to. There's a couple other things that just were rumors and I'm really probably shouldn't say, but I mean, I saw this was something else that I was going to ask you about Is that did somebody in the Lovovitz family do a shidduch with Rav Shlomo Karabach? Is that true? Absolutely. Rav Simcha Zissel, my great-uncle who worked on. Olo Rav Yisrael. Who wrote Olo Rav Yisrael? He married my great-aunt, shloma Karabach, who was Shloma Karabach's sister Absolutely. So how does the time work out, with meaning? Reb Yisrael obviously passed away before not Reb Yisrael, he passed away.

42:51 I don't know. 20 some odd years ago he was. He was actually when Reb Yisrael was nifter. Interestingly, he was supposed to be the. He was slated to take over his, but he was too young at the time. So they actually sent him to Calum first, and then the war broke out and then that whole thing. But when he came back to America he married Shlomo's Kalba. Wow, that's pretty cool. What else, if? One other thing maybe perhaps you could share with the audience that isn't well known about Mayer Reynu Hamashkiach Halevi? Okay, oh, I should tell you something that's not known. Oh, perhaps a story, something that we were not going to get in the general.

43:34 We don't give much credence to the stories, you know. You know we Stories would be pretty boring. You know what I mean. It's the mensch. It's what he was and what he taught and what he personified. It's not the moif sim or the stories. He was what he was. You know it's not the moif sim or the other stories. Uh, you know he was what he was. You know he did. He was a calmer calmer's. Did you know the same thing every day? You know? what I'm saying just did it better. You know, like the alto and calum would say you know, when it came like a yamana rhyme, he would say you know, everyone says I'm going to be better, I'm going to be better, right. He says don't be. I'll say it in english is don't be, I'll say it in English. He says don't be better, be different. Zayn is best. Zayn is best. I mean to be better. You know what happens when you're better. Then a few days later you're unbetter.

44:15 Now the point of Yom HaRom is to change Zayn, make a little little tiny change. That's what it's all about. I'll tell you something interesting. I don't this, but he has an interesting link. Rabbi Rucham himself never in his life shaved. He writes somewhere that he doesn't believe that shaving is correct, even though in the literature world over there everyone did shave. He writes that if I would have the strength, I would have abolished this whole shaving thing, because he felt that a Yiddish shouldn't shave. Why Does he have a reasoning? He writes me myself. I never in my life touched my beard. I guess he felt that's the. You know, you got to look like a Jew too. You know, obviously there's a reason why the B'nai Torah you know it was it was.

44:55 They started shaving and looking the way they did because they were fighting Haskalah at the time. Haskalah was making inroads, believe it or not, even into the, into our places. You know, the Chavetz Chaim himself was almost caught by the Haskalah. We all know that. Right, it's hard to believe. So one of the ways that the Gaddaison of that time dealt with that scholar was they figured that if the Bachum looked more put together and modern, like that, it would stop the fights and the deriding of the Beniterra looking unkempt or whatever it was. You know what. I mean. But the Etzim Samy didn't believe that Jews should shave, you know. Why? Because it's meaning it's also funny yeah.

45:37 Because I mean. It's Surah of a year. It's Surah of a year. It's with a beard, it's no question about that, as if Avraham Avinu had a beard. We're going to say Of course you think a Ramavinu shaved. I mean Right. I mean I don't know that to be a fact. I mean, we all know Reb Chaim Kanievsky was very much against shaving and you know they push course against it, even from the Liturgy of Gadolim, even though it was out there that we shaved. He had this thing. You know I saw the letter once. You know he wrote that Iyayash r'cheili. I would abolish it. And, interestingly, you know, unlike also unlike other Lutfash yeshivas at the time, if you came to the mirror, let's say from a Hasidic background and you were wearing long, you had a beard he would never let you change out of that.

46:21 You know he was very much. If your Maserah is to wear long, you got to hold on to your Maserah. He didn't let them come here and then adapt, so to speak, stories of people who, before they came, they changed, knowing that once they come he wouldn't let them change. You know, even Reb Chatzkel came from a Hasidic background. Believe it or not, reb Chatzkel was a Pilate and he heard one drasha right from about Tcheles right. He heard it in Erad way back in Erad and he got hooked and he just went where he said he became a Rebbe, you know. Right. I read in B'mechit Tassim that Rebbe Yerucham spoke that time about that.

47:04 Chazal, tell you that you're supposed to show you it's supposed to think of the blue water, think of the blue sky, think of the Almighty's throne. Kisya. HaKavod and Rebbe Chumash. He says Chazal wanted us to see a color, a color, just blue. And I think Kisya HaKavod, he said you have to see colors with your Ruchni as glasses, and if you're not learning Musa, then it's impossible. El Ami, we have to learn muslim, that's I heard. The drusha was okay makes sense, it's an inner status uh probably three okay so let's finish up here in regards to, uh, just the end of his life. He passed away. It sounds like he was rather young. I think he was in his 60s he was. He was very young, he was 62, he got sick and yeah and yeah, and he unfortunately passed away at the age of 62.

47:47 Yeah, and and then he is survived. By how many kids and Talmidim? Let's deal with kids and Talmidim as quick as possible. Well, his oldest son, rabbi Yisrael, was already married before the war and he was in Vilna in the Ramayos yeshiva, so he was not with the yeshiva. So he got killed by the Nazis, mach Shimon v'Zichra, him and his wife and his three kids. But the Nazis, him and his wife and his three kids, meir Rahama and Leah Hashem and Yacob Dama. After that he had Rabbi Abram, rabbi Moshaleh, rabbi Simcha Zissel, who has three sons, surviving sons who came to America, and his one daughter, chassia, who was married to Rabbi Shulchaim Kaplan. And and the Kaplan Mishpach. You know the telekaplan.

48:28 Then you have three kaplans. Everyone knows the three kaplans. That's the next generation of the kaplans that's all from his daughter. Oh, wow, I didn't know that. I didn't make that connection Interesting. And Talmidim who are? It sounds like the Talmidim are Reb Leib Malin and Reb Hatzkel, and Reb Leib Malin and Reb Hatzkel. And who's the foremost? Who's got the Masayurah? I don't know. Foremost, like you said, reb Leib Malin definitely was the line of the group, but you had Yad Vassilim, you had Reb Shimon Schwab, reb Shlomo Volbe you know Reb, what's his name?

49:09 Reb Rethel Feinstein went to the mirror. I mean, all the list goes on. Rebbe Dovah Povarsky was probably one of his closest, if not the closest, talmud. You know the Rashi of Aponovish. These were all all his Talmudim. Yeah, it. It definitely seems like Reb Volba has kind of the Masayurah in Chinuch from Reb Volba, Again Reb. Volba, interestingly, yeah, there's no question. I mean, reb Volba was from Germany, he was definitely part of the group that was the Icelander, so to speak. But he definitely got a very, very strong influence and he lived that the rest of his life. And everything he did, everything he saw evolved, was Reb Yerucham.

49:52 That's all he lived. You know, there's no question. But again, there was various levels of Talmud and some of them went the Musa route, so to speak, and some of them went the Rosh Hashiva route. You know, because, at the end of the day, you know, we, we know him from Musa, but the emir was Tyre. The emir was, you know, the emir was Tyre, you know, the greatest of the great. I mean Shanghai. They sat in Shanghai and they learned. I mean these people, you know, there's no way to describe these people. You know these people were I don't remember Shalva Shagatli, the ones who eventually became the Rosh Hashiva's, and Mat Talmud, where Mishat Talmud, you know, after the war, wasn't really a yeshiva or a sheshiva. It started just a group of the older bachim together and eventually the older bachim gave chaburas and eventually, you know, they became rosh yeshivas and that's how it was.

50:36 But these, you know, they were great. They were great people. You know, in Taira and Midas and Tefillah especially. That's one thing where Mir was excelled at that it wasn't just Torah, it was tefillah was a component. There's no Torah without tefillah. Rucham was very big with that. When someone came to Fahar and Amir and Rucham would ask him so when does your day start? And he would say from first Seder he goes no, from Shachar. If there's no Shachar, there's no first Seder. You can't come here if you're not going to keep the starim, which means shachars. Trilo was a very big component in the Meir Chatz will talk about it a lot. There's no Torah without Trilo.

51:17 There's no Trilo without Torah. Wow, and I know Elul was famous for Elul, correct? Of course Elul the older Balimus were famous for Elul. Salanto was known to say when Elul comes, even the fish in the water tremble right, right, did he change his schedule? did he change his schedule during Elul? It seems like he maybe spoke more during Elul he probably did. Yeah, I don't remember exactly, but he probably did, which is actually. You know, we're in the middle of my WhatsApp share we're actually doing now. We gave a whole introduction about that, but how the Balei Musser valued that safer tremendously.

51:59 Right, and I would like to explicitly point out to the audience that if they would like to be a part of that, they should definitely click the link in the description. I am on it and you definitely get a piece of Rabbi Rucham there and it's daily and it's Tazir and it's, it's definitely interesting. We started it when, when Rabbi Chaim, we started. I remember that for sure, yeah. Two, three minutes here and Baruch Hashem. You know, hundreds of people joined up. And it's you. Two, three minutes here and Baruch Hashem, hundreds of people joined up. I like it. It keeps me on my toes. If I can inspire people even a little bit, then I can be a Marbekot Shemayim and bring a little more Amunah to this world.

52:39 That lacks it very much. That's my escholos. That's it. So we can definitely say in conclusion that Mayerenu HaMashkiach Rebruchim Levavitz, who has Yortzay correct me if I'm wrong it's Chai Sivan and it's the 87th Yortzay, right. That many years since he's been gone, 1936. And he was a man who saw truth and he was a man who was helping out every single one of his bachrim and connecting even some of the weaker or the ones that didn't merit to have the same background and learn chumash rashi with them, give droshes, prepare them, build them.

53:26 And might we finish with this, all the Torah and the hashkafah and the inspiration that will go to people should go up and be an aliyah for his neshama. Amen. I know that it comes from a hakar satoiv point, just from myself just how much he's given me and my family, and I would most definitely want to express tremendous gratitude that you gave this time to the audience. I know that you are very busy and I know that you have a lot of horizon obligations to the cloud, to the general public, and therefore this time is. I am very thankful for it. They should smash the link below in order to listen, because they will not regret it and if you have any parting words, the floor is yours.

54:17 No, that's it. Thank you very much. It's a pleasure speaking with you. It's always a pleasure listening to you when I get a chance. And you should be matzlech and you should have schiath to the shmaya and you should keep spreading Kvart Shemayim, because that's what it's all about. Amen amen.